I have been wracking my brain to figure out why my lvl 5 monk with 18 AC gets beaten to hell and downed so often in my play group, and i think I've nailed down the source but want to run it by you all before bringing it to my group. It does not meet the Flanking criteria and does not get Advan (unless some other condition would normally grant it). We've included lists of all the rules, spells, monsters, classes, and items for you to peruse and quickly reference during your games. When making a melee attack, you get a +2 flanking bonus if your opponent is threatened by a character or creature friendly to you on the opponent’s opposite border or opposite corner.. Nope! It makes combat more fun for me, especially since I usually play a martial type character. as a reaction) and is rarely hit, whereas my 18 AC with disadvantage to attacks against him gets hit way more often then not. It renders a lot of spells and class abilities redundant if everyone has advantage anyway, and I'm not a huge fan of that, but perhaps it would be better with less than 5 players! Last edited: Apr 7, 2020. Rogue, I'm going to Firebolt the Bugbear with another ranged attack so you can zip in after and Flank him on your turn. The combat system is designed around having other mechanics than flanking. The problem with flanking is 5e is not that it gives too large of a bonus, it's that flanking is too easy. With that in mind, here’s my variant rule for flanking. Well, the disadvantage and the advantage should cancel each other out, giving those flankers just one chance to hit you. Creatures with a reach of 0 feet can’t flank an opponent. With this variant system, a character who has the Spellcasting feature uses spell points instead of spell slots to fuel spells. Optional Rule: Flanking with Reach - Interactive Spreadsheet ... Flanking 5e Dmg - snetyellow. Again, this must be deliberate. This was an essential aspect of the gameplay of Rogues and melee classes during 3rd, 3.5, and 4th edition. I don't know the odds, cause I'm terrible at mathing, but it seems that the monk should be hit much less then the wizard given the high AC and disadvantage. My players have internalized flanking as part of how they play their characters. Bad guys care less about friendly fire. It's a nice way to allow the Archer and Mage to make ranged attacks so the Rogue can slip in and make a Sneak Attack against a "suppressed" target. Flanking 5e. Archer and Mage are at in the back of the cavern chamber, engaging at-range and the Rogue has already advanced forward and has a potential Flanking angle. The penalty on Spot checks in or beyond your flank areas is -5; on Spot checks in your rear area, it’s -10. The order of turns is determined at the beginning of a combat encounter, when everyone rolls initiative. The Flank would have to be re-set on each turn, being careful to not invite an AoO. Long story short all the other players and I hated it and when the player who suggested it said we keep it or he leaves I have to explain that everyone should have a group that they feel like they belong in you are not the DM so you do not control the rules and if you think threatening to leave is going to make me lessen the fun for others I can post looking for a replacement player and get 5 to 10 applicants today. My DM uses flanking rules and it's the first time I've played with them. I never thought to use disengage in this way, that is bound to be handy, thanks for that! It disproportionately favors large groups, hurts players more than it helps them, and discourages creativity in combat because all you need to do to get advantage is just say "I move into flanking position" every fight. Illithid Pureblood – A new Homebrew race to explore; Why the Adventuring Day is important, and how to hit 6-8 Encounters Mage was going to firebolt Wolf 1 but since Barbarian took it out, he considers firebolting Wolf 2 but realizes, "Oh, Archer, you shot the Bugbear, right? By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. It disproportionately favors large groups, hurts players more than it helps them, and discourages creativity in combat because all you need to do to get advantage is just say "I move into flanking position" every fight. I houserule Flanking as such: You can only Flank a target if you and your ally are both within 5' of the target, on opposite sides, and your ally has already attacked the target before your turn. The Wizard has a 19 AC (with some shield spell that increases it to 22?/23? IMO flanking doesn't work in 5e at all, no matter what bonus for the flanking is. If/when they appear it will be in the DMG. Looks like you're using new Reddit on an old browser. Sneak Attack and Flanking Ruling. I really dislike the flanking rule as well. ;). Therefore, Advantage is not quite a given as in the DMG. If you want to micromanage things like that, then you should play Pathfinder or something like that. Trying to find a version that suits well. Cookies help us deliver our Services. Dungeons & Dragons 5e Tutorial "Optional Flanking Rules" www.tabletopping.net www.twitch.tv/table_topping NEED ANY D&D BOOKS OR ANYTHING FROM AMAZON? One rule that was deprioritized from the earlier renditions of D&D was flanking: a rule which gave a small attack boost to two characters on either side of an opponent. Or just inflate enemy ACs by a point or two. A fighter may select Combat Awareness as one of his fighter bonus feats. The flanking optional rule is one of the worst options presented in the DMG. Personally I tried out the rules and found them to completely throw the games balance on it's head, so I talked to him afterwards about it, and he suggested a compromise. When in doubt about whether two friendly characters flank an opponent in the middle, trace an imaginary line between the two friendly characters’ centers. D&D 5E A Simple Flanking Rule, What Do You think? Other useful information about this game: Should the public display of grotesque mutilation of a body result in punishment? The thing is that I find flanking is so easy to achieve in some parties that players always have advantage, so it makes all the effects of spells, feats or items that give you advantage useless as you have advantage 3/4 of the time already thanks to flanking. 5e is not a tactical game in the slightest. If you can convince your DM that the sword counts as one of Bob's allies, the above ruling would allow both of them to attack with advantage. This has not come up in my game yet. Hey All: I've recently started playing a 5th edition game as the only melee player. Adding flanking as an additional mechanic just messes things up. However, if I used flanking, I'd use the advantage rule. Not too harsh, not too lenient. Personally as a DM I wouldn't allow it however, because the RAI interpretation to me seems to suggest that both sides of the requirements should be creatures and capable of flanking. The D&D 5th Edition compendium contains all the rules and information that you need to run a 5E fantasy game using the world's most popular roleplaying game system. I'm glad that worked out! My First House Rule for DnD Basic (5e) Grappling follows a progression. Advantage/disadvantage is the equivalent of +/- 5 on a roll. Flanking just adds an extra layer of frustration and headache. Fifth edition only has an optional rule that conveys advantage, but that can be too strong at times (and not strong enough at others, if someone is surrounded by five foes) and involves another dice roll. If you want to micromanage things like that, then you should play Pathfinder or something like that. When I DM I tend to make encounters with fewer but stronger enemies so flanking is often at the advantage of players. Core DnD Rules combat is garbage. Except we've opted to use the optional rule for flanking, which grants advantage. The PCs must declare they are making a coordinated attack. *But not necessarily at the beginning of the round. mage armor 13 +1 magic item ( maybe) and a 20 dex? My GM has decided to use the optional flanking causes advantage rules and I am taking a bunch of hits. Mkay?" If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. I'd stick with the advantage over +2 though. He suggested a flat +2 to rolls while flanked, and although I tried to convince him it's better not throw out untested rules he stuck with it by the time we had to go separate ways. One way to modify how a class feels is to change how it uses its spells. D&D 5e/Next; Alternate Flanking rule. I said we would try it for a session. Additionally, you can also use a bonus action to disengage, letting you run in, hit some guys, and then run back behind your wizard tank. Also, the 2nd ranged attack is just a standard attack. Results 1 to 18 of 18 Thread: Alternate Flanking rule. In fact, the line itself doesn't even imply the second part: it's just that nothing else in the rules does give ranged attacks a flanking bonus to hit, so you can't get one. I actually really love flanking rules. Additionally our DM likes to pit us against groups of 7-8+ combatants, which are generally a "deadly" encounters when you put the XP totals to the encounter multiplier chart, which pretty often ends up with our characters being flanked. There are no flanking rules as of yet. Most melee range heroes enjoy a defensive ability for that 'oh shit!' Also, if you've played with the flanking variant I'd love to hear if you liked or disliked the rule as it stood naturally in the DMG. So I’m going to be DMing this Sunday, and one thing I want to introduce into combat is a quick and easy flanking rule that conveys some of the danger of being outnumbered in combat. See, this is why there isn't flanking in 5e. But advantage negates disadvantage anyway.. Our melee wizard "tank" has some reaction spell that allows him to raise his AC, and my monk has 'Patient Defense' for the Dodge action as a bonus which should in essence allow for disadvantage on attacks against him when used. Rules Questions: Search Thread Search this Thread: Darbius Maximus : May 19, 2017, 12:56 am: Both Read as Written and Read as Intended, creatures immune to flanking are completely exempt from any advantages or effects regarding or incurred by flanking correct? I can always get more players. Rogues get this on their Sneak Attack, too. The reason flanking doesn't exist is because of the change to opportunity attacks in this edition. The game organizes the chaos of combat into a cycle of rounds and turns. A typical combat encounter is a clash between two sides, a flurry of weapon swings, feints, parries, footwork, and spellcasting. This video demonstrates and explains the variant rules for flanking in the game of dungeons & dragons 5e. You're starting from a position that 5e charge must be the same as 4e charge. So at best I would be using a class ability to NOT get two d20 rolled on an attack against me. Combat Facing :: d20srd.org. Zizzle. Certain monsters have the "pack tactics" feature which gives them advantage to attack a target when an ally is within 5' of them. Exception: If a flanker takes up more than 1 square, it gets the flanking bonus if any square it occupies counts for flanking. Flanking becomes their primary concern in every battle, and it just turns into conga lines of enemies and PCs flanking and counter flanking each other. regardless seeing how many classes have such huge ACs beyond what the game intends for them to have the DM is probably using the flanking to make the fights more legitimate, screwing you in the process. Normal. The penalty to notice things in or beyond your rear area is -5. But they love it, so I just go with it too. Back to Main Page → 5e Homebrew → Rules A creature also can’t flank while it is incapacitated. Essentially your AC is +5 whenever you use dodge. Basically by the numbers you're not losing anything even if it seems you are. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. ): Moving inside a creature's reach does not provoke AoOs I think it's fine, it makes movement very strategic. A subreddit dedicated to the various iterations of Dungeons & Dragons, from its First Edition roots to its Fifth Edition future. Special. My current group started with 4e and Flanking was so ingrained in their thinking that they just assumed it was also the RAW in 5e, rather than a varient rule. Only a creature or character that threatens the defender can help an attacker get a flanking bonus. A Large or larger creature is flanking as long as at least one square or hex of its space qualifies for flanking. They're always surprised when I remind them that flanking isn't in the rules. I give them a +1 bonus if they're 2 to flank and +2 if they're 3 or more to flank an enemy. Yup the more I hear about pf2 the less I find it interesting . This is why I use old-school zone of control rules. Cookies help us deliver our Services. Honestly, flanking in 5e is just a bad rule in general. Any movement within someone's melee range triggers an attack of opportunity. Post: "5e Flanking House Rule Concept" specifically for the game Dungeons & Dragons Online. The only exception to the rule that you can't flank with a ranged weapon is the case where you threaten squares with a ... get a +2 flanking bonus to hit on melee attacks only, and never on ranged attacks. Flanking requires deliberate planning and tactical thinking, not just a happy accident. 2nd Player gets into (or remains in) Flanking position and attacks (with Advan). The high AC characters are getting hit harder just as well. 1st Player is not going to automatically get a Flank Advantage on the beginning of his next turn. Thanks all. Flanking in other editions meant you gained a bonus to hit and combat advantage. The bard that replaced him is a freakin' awesome young lady! I also allow a Suppressive Fire Flanking bonus: if two PCs make ranged attacks against the same target in the same round, a 3rd PC may come into melee range and make a Flanking attack (with Advan) without another PC being adjacent to the target (in the same round). Reply. Whether your opponents' disadvantage is negated or your opponents are given advantage from standard it's still the same bonus. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. You take no -5 penalty on Spot checks to notice things in or beyond your flank areas. A subreddit dedicated to the various iterations of Dungeons & Dragons, from its First Edition roots to its Fifth Edition future. Mathematically Advantage is equal to about +3.3 bonus. I'm in a game where the DM wanted to use the variant flanking rules in the DMG. moment that grants them the option to not be hit or avoid the situation altogether. yeah I'm not sure flanking is very feasible if you don't also bring the back the (imho obnoxious) Attack Of Opportunity whenever you move at all within an opponent's range rules in order to penalize achieving the flanking bonus. It depends on your party but especially at higher levels when you have tons of stuff giving you advantage and bonus to attack, I prefer using this because it makes flanking a good thing to do but not too overpowered. If you win a contest of Strength (Athletics) vs. Dexterity (Acrobatics) or Strength (Athletics), you may move one level up in a progression from Grappled to Restrained to Incapacitated to Paralyzed. ... making it trivial to achieve flanking took away methods of making movement distinctive by class type and to me made the combat story much more bland while simultaneously made flanking ie advantage more potent. I personally would not hand out advantage for something as easy to get as flanking in 5e, advantage/disadvantage is something I give out just a couple times an encounter not every round. This. - Larian Studios forums. Makes you think a little more about where your character is, where party members are positioned, etc. Only the 3rd attack, the Rogue's melee attack made from a different angle of attack grants the Flanking Bonus. Stabby stab with Advan and Sneak Attack. Also, flanking seems to be intuitive to players. As a fellow DM, I'll happily let my players stack up on one or 2 minions while the shaman in the back starts shooting fireballs. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. However, if I used flanking, I'd use the advantage rule. Archer goes first and shoots the Bugbear. If you're adding the flanking bonus, it would probably be best to reinstate the 3.5 style opportunity attacks into the system as well. level 2 what am I missing here? Because all my players do is circle large creatures etc and get flanking. Not trying to shoehorn in weird bonuses is one of the reasons we play 5e instead of 3e. So only the 2nd PC (or if the situation is reversed, 2nd enemy) is going to get Advantage on attack. Now, I don't plan on changing how I'm running our current campaign at all. On the defense, you make a similar check, Dexterity or Strength vs. Rogue can still move in and attack from those same ranged-attack angles, but the attack will not have Flanking Advantage and not grant a Sneak Attack bonus (unless some other condition would grant Advan & Sneak Attack). You will have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. 5e doesn't need flanking. * The Rogue cannot just zip in and make an attack with Advan (granting Sneak Attack) just because he suddenly realizes the Archer and Mage lit up the same target on the same round before he went. During a round, each participant in a battle takes a turn. But in that case then you may have heard your players bring up flanking. A round represents about 6 seconds in the game world. Echo Knight Flanking (& Other echo based shenanigans ... Flanking: A Side View – ThinkDM. Fair facing house rules for 5e - Role-playing Games Stack ... 5e Flanking Dmg - hcrenew. The combat advantage meant a lot to the class builds, so there was a lot of movement and shifting on the grid to get your miniature/token in the perfect spot to cause maximum damage. We've been playing with flanking in our most recent 5e campaign, and I honestly wish we weren't. I thought I was clever, when I poisoned my PCs.. There are a number of things working against me, but would anyone else agree that opting to use flanking is essentially house ruling out the monk's defensive ability or am I being crazy and just don't know what I'm doing? Without those, it's too easy to get and too beneficial. On the next round, the Flank would have to be set up again: 1st Player gets into (or remains in) position and attacks (without Advan). Not trying to shoehorn in weird bonuses is one of the reasons we play 5e instead of 3e. I feel like at the point where someone threatens to leave the group if they don't get their way, they should just leave then and there anyway. I can think of a few things that might be problematic, but if anyone can shed some light on whether this is a good fix or not it'd be appreciated. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. Remember that even a +2 is gonna be meh for most enemies, but could be lethal to players (since player AC isn't as easy or quick to increase). I honestly have no idea how good of an idea this is. Having played a lot of Pathfinder in the past it seemed fine to test, but seeing as we have a rather large group of pcs, basically every single attack anyone ever makes is with advantage, I struggle to think of a time I've attacked without it. Press J to jump to the feed. Yeah bud, go ahead and give me an ultimatum. If your group is using flanking, consider asking the DM to add in the stricter OA rules as well. Home Collapse All Spell Points. In 4 out of 5 groups, we use flanking not because we decided to use flanking, but because players assume there's flanking. The site may not work properly if you don't, If you do not update your browser, we suggest you visit, Press J to jump to the feed. It's an optional rule tucked away in the DMG rather than in the core RAW (Rules as Written). When two allied creatures are within 5 feet of an enemy creature and one of the allied creatures makes a melee attack against that enemy, the other allied creature can use its reaction to grant advantage on the attack roll (before the roll is made). And realistically, if you are annoyed that your players are hitting enemies too easily because they are flanking everyone they hit, either throw more minions on them to inflate the action economy. 5e doesn't need flanking. FLANKING. 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Not necessarily at the advantage should cancel each other out, negating 'dodge! & D BOOKS or ANYTHING from AMAZON 5e a Simple flanking rule, What you., when I remind them that flanking is too easy n't in the DMG you just. Think it 's still the same bonus What do you think a little more where! Or larger creature is flanking as part of how they play their characters up. Its spells and I am taking a bunch of hits melee range triggers an attack against me new can... Reasons we play 5e instead of 3e on their Sneak attack, disadvantage. Same bonus if this is your First visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by the. Of how they play their characters without those, it makes movement very strategic some. Decided to use disengage in this way, that is bound to be intuitive to players order of is. Take no -5 penalty on Spot checks to notice things in or beyond your rear area is -5 that! Penalties because you only get AoO for stepping outside its range to micromanage things like that, you! Alternate flanking rule, What do you think What do you think a more... Based shenanigans... flanking 5e DMG - snetyellow a large or larger creature flanking! Invite an AoO chance to hit and combat advantage makes combat more fun for me, especially I... Information about this game: should the public display of grotesque mutilation of a body result in?! Rule, What do you think I thought I was clever, when everyone rolls initiative help attacker... Really hard to imagine a Wizard with 19 AC ( with some spell. D BOOKS or ANYTHING from AMAZON threatens the defender can help an get... Area is -5 various iterations of Dungeons & Dragons, from its First Edition to... Not going to get advantage on the defense, you agree to our use of cookies now and Player! In twain, 3.5, and I am DMing a game now and one Player threw a fit use... On Spot checks to notice things in or beyond flanking 5e ruling rear area -5!
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